Is this a scene from a noir thriller or a romantic drama? Hard to tell.
The following scene sets a very different tone:
That's as brutal a fight as you will see in a film from the middle of the twentieth century.
But this is also a gorgeous film. Beautiful Western vistas, sunny Mexican vacation spots, great hair....
The story and pacing are finely crafted. The developments of character are intriguing. And the film offers a few twists on the familiar genre. So, you could respond to the effect of adding Ann, the innocent female, to the tale of the PI and the femme fatale. You could discuss the bigger moral issue: what do you make of Jeff's decision to leave with Kathie at the end? What does this say about his character? Or you could place this film in the context of the noir's tradition of exploring the nature of human decisions. Is Jeff trapped by fate as Detour emphasized? Is he a victim or is he responsible for his situation?
I think that one large difference between this and most other noir films are the characters aren’t just pushed on by fate but are really responsible for their actions. This really comes to the fore front when you think about Jeff. He goes down the path he does when he decides to go after Kathie. It is clear that Whit is not a good person when he hires Jeff, so it is Jeff’s own fault to accept the job. He further compounds the issue when he decides to run away from Whit to be with Kathie. He also shows how his life is in his hands when he calls the police to alert them that he is running away to Mexico with Kathie. He could have been fine and lived however out of his own power he decides that he was going to end it all. In conclusion this film differs from most noir movies because of the characters free will.
ReplyDeleteAnn's presence makes the character of Jeff seem more sympathetic. He cares about her enough to tell her the truth about his past, showing the viewer that he genuinely wants to start over with a new relationship before he is dragged back into a last PI case. It also gives the viewer another reason to hope for Jeff's survival for Ann's happiness. Ann's complete trust in Jeff's unwillingness to commit murder and lost love for Kathie makes us question whether that trust is misplaced. In the case of murder, Ann is right. The case of Jeff's love for Kathie is unclear. He says that he no longer hates Kathy as he did during the time they were apart, but he doesn't adore her like he did in Acapulco and San Francisco. By the end of the movie, he is resentful of and no longer willing to forgive her lies and betrayals. I think his decision to run away with Kathie and call the police was the morally right decision, even though it left Ann bereaved. Since Kathie threatened to blame all three murders on him if he didn't run away with her, Jeff didn't have the option of returning to Ann without putting her in danger and on the wrong side of the law. When he had to die or run away with a woman he no longer loved, Jeff chose to bring Kathy down with him and protect the world from any more of her double-crossing. Ann also had Jim to return to.
ReplyDeleteJeff, to me, is more like Hammer than any of the other main characters we have seen so far. While he doesn't seem quite as simple minded as Hammer, he is certainly not as clever as Marlowe. I feel that he is similar to Hammer because he repeatedly, automatically turns to violence when faced with a sticky situation. I think that this film, and the last, have been more focused on the fight scenes than on the intricacies and complications of whatever the private investigator is trying to solve. In the first few films we watched, there was not nearly as much violence or action, and the main character used his fists or weapon as a last resort.
ReplyDeleteI think that Jeff left with Kathie, not because he had chosen her over Ann, but just the reverse - he phoned the police with the knowledge that they would either arrest or shoot, then got in the car with her. I think he was finally too tired to keep playing the games and running the races that his unfortunate past had kept him in. Jeff was seeking to finally stop Kathie's shenanigans, and decided to add himself to the pile. He left Ann so that she'd move on - if he was still alive and well and free, he knew that she would never completely forget him; he didn't want to drag her along. The boy who worked for him knew his intention, and so told Ann that he had really intended to run off with Kathie - thus fulfilling Jeff's wish. He ends up being portrayed as not remarkably invested in justice, but mostly tired and morally logical.
ReplyDeleteHe certainly put himself into the criminal world - that is his own fault - but he was most certainly not prepared for where it led him. He acted his part, and he was good at it, but he was all too easily convinced to run for it to actually mean much to him - not to mention how disturbed he was when Kathie shot the man he was fighting. He backed out, he ran, and he set up a new name and persona: THAT was his choice. It was chance that he was found, and simply the other men's inability to let him go that led to the second half of the movie. It was perhaps not fate, but it was not his choice to be dragged back. He is a competent victim who works with the circumstances that life throws at him - but sometimes he just doesn't make the best choices.
I was under the impression that Jeff’s final phone call was to the police, so I considered his leaving with Kathie an act of selflessness. When Kathie threatens Jeff, offering him the option of coming with her or being framed for her murders, she’s also threatening his future with Ann, whom I believe he truly loves. By driving into the line of police fire he ordered, Jeff is offering up his life to save Ann from the consequences of his entanglement in Whit’s web. Because he does this consciously and willingly, this also ties into the lack of fatalism characteristic of most noir films: Jeff calls the police in, knowingly risking his life, because dying is preferable to hurting Ann.
ReplyDeleteNow that I’ve written this, though my perception of the film and Jeff’s character supports my above-defined belief, one detail keeps nagging me: the audience never becomes familiar enough with Ann to make her a reasonable motive for Jeff to risk his life. He obviously loves her--he expresses his love--but we don’t love her because we don’t know her: I think that, in order to analyze Jeff’s decision to make the call and go with Kathie, we need more information on the true object of his affection. Regardless, I don’t think he ever truly intended to run away with Kathie--I think he’s a smart man who is all too familiar with her conniving ways and not one to make the same mistake twice.
I think that the point of putting Ann in the movie was show Jeff's new life and what he has now. I think they put her in so that the audience would root for Jeff because he has a life to return too. It showed his soft side and made him seem more human and relatable. I think that when he saw that Whit was dead he had no other choice than to turn himself in with Kathie since Katie now had an upper hand on Jeff. I don't think this makes him any less human or a bad person. He tried to get everything under control with Whit and Kathie. I think it was a brave move to call the police because he knew that he needed to take down Kathie because she caused the whole thing and she needed to be
ReplyDeleteThis movie does have an extremely different style compared to the other Noir films that we have watched. The characters act a bit different and are less dumb. Jeff isn't all that violent. He just wants to become "normal" and forget the past. The only character that seemed like a real Noir character was Kathie, she was a femme fatale. Kathie obtained a powerful and deadly personalty, she killed more than one person. She also gave off her powerful vibe in the end when she is taking Jeff to Mexico, but won't tell him much information. She mentions that she is in charge. So other than Kathie the Noir aspect that we saw previously has changed into a brighter more fleshed out version.
ReplyDeleteThis film has a completely different style than the other films we have watched in the class. In Detour, the character was a victim of fate and how fate drove him through his situations. However, Jeff isn’t a victim of fate in Out of the Past. I think that all of the situations that Jeff was in were due to his own choices and responsibility. At the end, Jeff is faced with the decision of running off with Kathie. This is a perfect example of how Jeff makes his own choices in the film rather than letting fate make them for him. Jeff, overall, is a much more simple and straightforward character in comparison to other characters we’ve seen previously.
ReplyDeleteTruly no character in this film deserved another. Ann was too good, and on the other hand Kathie was to bad. I do feel that Jeff loved Kathie, but he was in love with Ann. Ann seems to think after talking with his employee that Jeff had chosen Kathie over her. However, that was not the case. He was tired and ready for all of it to end. To finally face his past and the consequences. That is proven because he turned both of them in. Honestly, Kathie made the choice much easier for him. She threatened a possible future with Ann, let alone a future at all if he didn’t come with her. She was completely willing to throw him under the bus and have him framed for murder.
ReplyDeleteI think Jeff is a complicated person. On one hand, he is first presented living a ho-hum life, carving out a living pumping gas. He seems calm, smart, and composed. His initial interaction with Joe and relationship with Ann both suggest Jeff is wise, mysterious, and perhaps a bit weary. Regardless, he seems content in his quiet lifestyle. Minutes later, we are introduced to a new (albeit younger) Jeff--a flirtatious, smooth-talking investigator who breaks the rules by running away with a woman he's supposed to capture. We see this latter Jeff--deceiving, aggressive, even violent at times--as the plot thickens and Jeff is pulled in for one last job.
ReplyDeleteSubsequently, I find it hard to believe that Jeff ever planned to be with Kathie or ever chose to believe her. I could be wrong. Maybe he really wants to be with her. But his interactions and promises with Ann seem both passionate and honest, and Jeff is just too smart not to expect that Kathie would have something up her sleeve. And then there's the telephone call, which I strongly suspect was made to the police. It's complicated, but I doubt Jeff was ever one step behind. That being said, it's hard to ever see him as the "victim" even though he dies. Always, throughout the film, Jeff is calm and collected, even when he's on the verge of capture. I think he's responsible for what has happened to him and is at peace with his decisions--or he recognizes that it's fate or life and just leaves it at that.
I think Jeff is some what trapped by fate, haunted by a past he can't escape. He doesn't come across as a victim, however, and he recognizes that his actions make him responsible for the events of the film. Its like being stuck at a family game night. You can't escape, so you might as well play the game all the way through to the end.
ReplyDeleteThe addition of Ann to the story provided a plausible reason for Jeff to want to get away from his past, which is juxtaposed with Kathie, who desperately tries to pull him back into the his old way of life. Ann would allow Jeff to start over, leaving the mire of his past actions behind. I think that her innocence is what initially convinces Jeff to leave with Kathie. When his past catches up with him, he follows along with it, rather than moving past it, cementing the idea that he was an inherently bad person in his own mind, therefore making him unworthy of Ann and the redemption she represents. He probably planned to allow himself to be shot by the police with Kathie, though she killed him before that could happen. I believe the deaf mute kid recognized Jeff's feelings for Ann, and lied to her so that Ann would move on, which is what Jeff would have wanted.
I feel like the addition of Ann made it seem like more of a romantic drama. The PI was was torn between two woman and it played out throughout the whole film. I felt like all the noir tropes were played up in this film. The mystery is several layers deep, there is extreme violence and Kathie double crosses him several times. It was so exaggerated it almost became something you wouldn't classify as noir.
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ReplyDeleteIn my option this one did not differ an extreme amount from the other Moira films that we have seen. The police showed up almost never, which we have kind of seen before. The main character did have female troubles, and there was some violence seen. An interesting aspect is that Kathie was very evil and did a good job giving the viewer perspective on the female role as a villain vs. a hero. Ann was what many would have considered to be the classic friendly girl who gave us an image of innocence compared to Kathie. An aspect that differs this film from the rest is that Jeff just kind of wanted a normal life, while a lot of the other main characters almost didn't care about how normal there lives were, they just wanted answers.
I feel like Jeff put himself in a bad place by having to choose between two girls. The movie would have ended badly for Jeff and whichever partner he chose. I also didn't see why he didn't end both relationships. I'm not sure what his choice says about him. Maybe it says he'd rather die than go to jail. I think they put ann in the movie to make him more relatable but to me he wasn't that relatable because he was basically living two lives, and trying to get rid of the PI one. I feel he is responsible for his situation.
ReplyDeleteI think that the character of Anne was added to the plot to show that every man (and woman) has good and bad in them. Jeff is able to love a woman who lies and manipulates others so much its hard to tell who she truly is and he falls in love with a small town woman who is compassionate and even still lives with her parents. These two women are like the angel and the devil sitting on Jeff's shoulders. We watch him struggle with who to choose. He ends up going off with Kathie and getting shot. Makes the viewer wonder had he stayed with Anne if he would've lived.
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